Kill all non-Muslims ? – I

#255 by ali87 on June 28, 2003 4:07pm PT
#254 by dost-mittar on June 28, 2003 8:15am PT

It is clearly recognised by even a basic student of quran(as appossed to a child/childlike reciter) That the Qurans verses explain each other. Ie one supports/qualifies/explains another. Morever a verse needs to be qouted in full and often with the ones following it and preceding it and also sometimes the context(often historical, ie pertaining to a particular situation so if a partiucalr situation occurs then the advice in the sura becomes valid.) at times some verses are explained/qualified elsewere in the quran.

This is what pmishra2 has quoted..

Sura 9:5 says, “Fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every strategem of war.”

The full verse is this…

http://islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/9.htm#5

“But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.”

Notice the fullstop included by Mishra at the end of the quote. and the semicolon in this transalation and the Qualifier “but” and then the rest of the verse. Also there is some thing ahead of the quote which he quotes.

here is the verse which precedes the verse quoted by Mishra

9.4″(But the treaties are) not dissolved with those Pagans with whom ye have entered into alliance and who have not subsequently failed you in aught, nor aided any one against you. So fulfil your engagements with them to the end of their term: for Allah loveth the righteous.”

….So here is the verse preceding which says that those treaties established with pagans are not dissolved where the pagans have not failed in observing their side of the treaty nor have aided any other enemy against you.
Meaning that if pagans have signed a treaty with you and hold true to you and also do not aid your enemies you are commanded to “fulfil your engagements with them” because “Allah loveth the righteous”

The next verse which mishra quotes then explains how to deal(which should be obvious to even the simple minded)with those Pagans who have voilated your treaties(usually these are life and death issues in a very voilent land) and/or have aided your enemies against you(this is also significant “aided any one (ememies)”… against you ie helping the enemy in fighting you).

The next verse says…

9.6. If one amongst the Pagans ask thee for asylum, grant it to him, so that he may hear the word of Allah. and then escort him to where he can be secure. That is because they are men without knowledge.

This is self obvious.. ie even among those who have betrayed you if any ask for Asylum grant him and escort him wher he can be secure…. these people are not (evil) they are “men without knowledge.”

The next verse goes on…

9.7. “How can there be a league, before Allah and His Messenger, with the Pagans, except those with whom ye made a treaty near the sacred Mosque? As long as these stand true to you, stand ye true to them: for Allah doth love the righteous.”

Briefly this says that there cant be a league with pagans except those whom you made a treaty with(“near the scared Mosque”…Thus one needs to know the historical context too) you and are true to the treaty. One is exhorted to be true to your treaties because “Allah doth love the righteous”

The next verse is..

9.8. “How (can there be such a league), seeing that if they get an advantage over you, they respect not in you the ties either of kinship or of covenant? With (fair words from) their mouths they entice you, but their hearts are averse from you; and most of them are rebellious and wicked.”

….Ie it explains further the previous verse (ie why there cant be a league with pagans.. those who break treaties… not others) These pagans respect neither ties of “Kinship” or of “Covenant” they are scheming “With (fair words from) their mouths they entice you, but their hearts are averse from you” It furhter says “most (ie those who dont remain true to their treaties ie even among those Pagans who dont fulfil their own treaties most … ie not all)of them are rebellious and wicked.”

next verse says..

9.9 “The Signs of Allah have they sold for a miserable price, and (many) have they hindered from His way: evil indeed are the deeds they have done.

The next verse says..

9.10. “In a Believer they respect not the ties either of kinship or of covenant! It is they who have transgressed all bounds”

…ie those Pagans respect neither ties of kinship or of covenant(ie treaty) with the Belivers(in partiuclar ie with an intent to harrass the muslim in partiuclar) ie these pagans are singlingout the muslims in particular.

The next verse says…

9.11. But (even so), if they repent, establish regular prayers, and practise regular charity,- they are your brethren in Faith: (thus) do We explain the Signs in detail, for those who understand.

…. here it says they repent (ie the Pagans who are Trangessors of treaties and ties of kinship), establish regular prayers(now is that a conditon or is it sufficient if they repent) and practice regular charity they are your Brothers in Faith.

Now this will be diffiuclt to interpret for a lay person like me. What does that mean? If a Trangressor repents he should also simultaneously establish regular prayers(Islamic?) and practice regular charity(muslim kind or any charity?) to qualify his repentence. It further goes on to say that “we explain the Signs(of repentence? of trangressors?) in detail (which is why there is series of verses ..not one) for those who understand(?)

This is where the limitation of reading translations of Quran become obvious and also reading it in parts and without the historical background and knowledge of the slightly different classical arabic (of the times of Prophets time and the particualr dialect followed by tribes living there.) becomes Important. This is where the role of the scholar comes in..

You can appreciate that the even a basic reading of even a few verses (much less of a full sura) cant be done in such a forum.
People like Mishra are hatemongers who delibrately distort and misquote (even when they are aware of it) to potray the Quran and thus muslims as some kind of Uncivilised eager to kill people.

While it is clear form even a cursory readign that the particular sura guides the muslim to be aware of those Pagans who delibrately reject signed treaties and ties of Kinship and the verses in the sura extort to be ruthless with those pagans (at a time when the muslim community was nacent and was indeed suffering many attacks to their life and property) but even so most verses keep reminding that there should be no trangression on part of the muslims and asks the muslims to honor their treaties “because Allah loves the righteous” and to be kind to those who repent and further explains that they do this acts not because they are “Evil” but because they are not men withouth Knowledge(Like Mishra??)

In a world which lives comfortably with the likes of Bush and Rumsfield (whom the Parivar is particularly enthused by .. and Mishra too) who brand entire nations as “Evil” it is no wonder that muslims take pride in their religon.

I hope that this is a lesson to you Mishra……

[Reply to interact #255]

http://www.chowk.com/show_article.cgi?aid=00002085&channel=university%20ave&threshold=10&layout=0&order=0&start=60&end=69&page=1#254

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